Morrissey as folk devil

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Morrissey is born under a bad sign.


Foreshadowed the death of Princess Diana.


Encourages the occult.

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Is Satanic.

 
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Morrissey is born under a bad sign.


Foreshadowed the death of Princess Diana.

I'm not an expert, but he has Jupiter very close to his Moon, which means that his sensitility is increased and that his mother has a huge influence in his life. I think both things are true. Mars and Venus are very close, that means he was born to be attractive to others, which can be a blessing or a curse. He has the Sun very close to Lilith, just like me. That means the person can feel outcasted because the black moon diminishes the bright of the sun, the identity. This sort of people need freedom, hate routine and they may have premonitory dreams. Being born under Saturn in Capricorn means the person is very ambitious.
 
Morrissey is born under a bad sign.


Foreshadowed the death of Princess Diana.


Encourages the occult.

View attachment 66511

View attachment 66512

Is Satanic.


I can remember reading this at the time..... great letter from morrissey, no wonder the press hate him.
But this is why WE love him....
 
He wasn't being panned in 1999 for his "views".

Bonfire & Notre Dame have already caused enough controversy to be another nail in his current coffin.

& Marr wouldn't touch him with a barge pole.
Steven Wells was calling him a far-right racist in the NME in the late 90s. He once encouraged like-minded people to attend Morrissey’s concerts and ‘brick him offstage’.
 
He wasn't being panned in 1999 for his "views".

Bonfire & Notre Dame have already caused enough controversy to be another nail in his current coffin.

& Marr wouldn't touch him with a barge pole.
Also, Quantick—who was writing for the music press in the 90s.

When Tony Parsons published his defence of Morrissey, in Vox(?) in late ‘92, it was definitely because Morrissey was coming under fire for his views—no other reason.
 
Also, Quantick—who was writing for the music press in the 90s.

When Tony Parsons published his defence of Morrissey, in Vox(?) in late ‘92, it was definitely because Morrissey was coming under fire for his views—no other reason.

No, it wasn't his 'views'.

The music press had been threatening to end his career for years if he didn't give more interviews & either straighten out or come out. Gary Bushell thought he was a pervert - so did Steve Sutherland, James Brown - & Dave Haslam.

Steve Wells gloated that he would end up like Jimmy Pursey if he wrote songs like Suedehead - Sham 69's career having been derailed because they couldn't escape the association with far right violence that the press had created. Quantick had been frothing about Morrissey cancelling Glastonbury just before Madstock - which is bloody odd if you think he's a fash.

The reason they couldn't let it go when he came back in 2004 & had to keep smearing him as right-wing - is because in 1993 they lied that a BNP supporter had scrawled Morrissey & the lads' names on a wall in Tower Hamlets - giving the BNP a huge amount of ongoing coverage in a youth paper months before they won their first council seat in Tower Hamlets. They didn't remember how openly bigoted they were in the 80s & 90s - so no matter how screwed Morrissey's career is now - there will be a reckoning.

I don't think Morrissey fully understands what he's been endorsing for the last 6 years - but there's no point giving him shit advice - even on a fan forum.
 
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I don't think Morrissey fully understands what he's been endorsing for the last 6 years.
Everyone else thinks he does.
What you mean is that you couldn’t handle it if Morrissey does fully understand what he endorses, so you’d rather portray him as a naive, stupid old simpleton with no capacity to think for himself. Which is odd.
 
No, it wasn't his 'views'.

The music press had been threatening to end his career for years if he didn't give more interviews & either straighten out or come out. Gary Bushell thought he was a pervert - so did Steve Sutherland, James Brown - & Dave Haslam.

Steve Wells gloated that he would end up like Jimmy Pursey if he wrote songs like Suedehead - Sham 69's career having been derailed because they couldn't escape the association with far right violence that the press had created. Quantick had been frothing about Morrissey cancelling Glastonbury just before Madstock - which is bloody odd if you think he's a fash.

The reason they couldn't let it go when he came back in 2004 & had to keep smearing him as right-wing - is because in 1993 they lied that a BNP supporter had scrawled Morrissey & the lads' names on a wall in Tower Hamlets - giving the BNP a huge amount of ongoing coverage in a youth paper months before they won their first council seat in Tower Hamlets. They didn't remember how openly bigoted they were in the 80s & 90s - so no matter how screwed Morrissey's career is now - there will be a reckoning.

I don't think Morrissey fully understands what he's been endorsing for the last 6 years - but there's no point giving him shit advice - even on a fan forum.
I recall the graffiti by the ‘BNP supporter’ running as a story (in the NME I think). It was definitely used to add credibility to a media discourse about Morrissey’s views that was already up and running—and had gathered momentum with the Madstock NME cover/article, and Morrissey’s subsequent refusal to grant them an interview. I guess you could say the negative tone was sustained by homophobia. But it was his views that were being scrutinised: his qualified support of football violence, and his celebration of the ‘Englishness’ of Madstock, and the imagery—in promotional interviews and materials—and reviews of the lyrics. But even this new speculation fed into longstanding critiques of Bengali and Asian Rut.

Perhaps the best reference would be the NME letters page, for about 6 months from Summer ‘92. It’s Morrissey’s apparent right wing perspectives that are being ‘discussed’.

There was some kind of truce in 2002, when The Smiths topped an NME greatest ever band poll. But after the 2006 interview the negativity picked up from where it left off, basically.

I’d suggest the Brexit vote (which Morrissey had basically argued for since Goldsmith was its champion) had Morrissey believe his opinions were now mainstream. He was right, to some extent. But the ‘mainstream’ don’t buy many records by ‘indie’ pop stars.
 
I recall the graffiti by the ‘BNP supporter’ running as a story (in the NME I think). It was definitely used to add credibility to a media discourse about Morrissey’s views that was already up and running—and had gathered momentum with the Madstock NME cover/article, and Morrissey’s subsequent refusal to grant them an interview. I guess you could say the negative tone was sustained by homophobia. But it was his views that were being scrutinised: his qualified support of football violence, and his celebration of the ‘Englishness’ of Madstock, and the imagery—in promotional interviews and materials—and reviews of the lyrics. But even this new speculation fed into longstanding critiques of Bengali and Asian Rut.

Perhaps the best reference would be the NME letters page, for about 6 months from Summer ‘92. It’s Morrissey’s apparent right wing perspectives that are being ‘discussed’.

There was some kind of truce in 2002, when The Smiths topped an NME greatest ever band poll. But after the 2006 interview the negativity picked up from where it left off, basically.

I’d suggest the Brexit vote (which Morrissey had basically argued for since Goldsmith was its champion) had Morrissey believe his opinions were now mainstream. He was right, to some extent. But the ‘mainstream’ don’t buy many records by ‘indie’ pop stars.

I've read the letters pages - some of the kids may have believed it was about racism - it's pretty obvious the hacks knew it was a lie.

It's 100% about his sexuality/remoteness. The racism angle started in 1986 when Frank Owen tried to out him & wrote a load of bilge about Panic. But the inference was always that he fancied "rough boys".

Morrissey said he didn't know why he was being associated with Brexit when he didn't vote & had hardly mentioned it.
 
I've read the letters pages - some of the kids may have believed it was about racism - it's pretty obvious the hacks knew it was a lie.

It's 100% about his sexuality/remoteness. The racism angle started in 1986 when Frank Owen tried to out him & wrote a load of bilge about Panic. But the inference was always that he fancied "rough boys".

Morrissey said he didn't know why he was being associated with Brexit when he didn't vote & had hardly mentioned it.
He had explicitly—all be it with humour—shared a desire for a UK independent of the EU in a mid-nineties interview. If memory serves me right, it was the Q interview where he appeared on the cover in a pink shirt. In it, he shares a desire to see us cut off from the continent, thro’ the Channel Tunnel’s bombing.

AMW was pro-Brexit.
 
He had explicitly—all be it with humour—shared a desire for a UK independent of the EU in a mid-nineties interview. If memory serves me right, it was the Q interview where he appeared on the cover in a pink shirt. In it, he shares a desire to see us cut off from the continent, thro’ the Channel Tunnel’s bombing.

AMW was pro-Brexit.

He may not have liked the EU any more than he liked any other authority - but if he was that interested in it, he wouldn't have wondered why the press kept associating him with it.

Der Spiegel asked him if he was for Brexit & he said no.

When he was talking about AMW he mentioned animal welfare & the Law being equal for everyone - things clearly being punted at him by far right activists attracted by the myth IPC created.

Typically, the far right ruined it by in-fighting. He can't be a balls out white supremacist AND a centre right person with reasonable views about mass immigration getting maligned by the woke.

But he's still picking up bits of their guff & putting it into songs/stage patter - so his career is in limbo.
 
He can't be a balls out white supremacist AND a centre right person with reasonable views about mass immigration getting maligned by the woke.
I think he can, to some extent, perhaps being more careful, yes, but as an artist exploring the modern human condition, there's a case for being able to at least acknowledge variety? You have to really. Take that quote you produced of Morrissey saying Trump would race into war for peace, while it's Biden who insists he must keep wars in Ukraine and Gaza going for Americans' best interest, in terms of both the economy and security. The world is in flux. Governments and institutions of the West are supposed to be tolerant and diverse, and supportive of dialectic reasoning. When beliefs that don't chime with one's own are ignored or outlawed, there's little chance for either side to understand issues.

How can you consciously contemplate, when there's no debate, no debate?
We make choices in life because of our background, our family, where we grew up, our education, our environment and all the views that have been handed down to us, have been offered to us that we have accepted. It’s a view that came to be because of causes and conditions. I have this view because of these causes and conditions. They have that view because of their causes and conditions. When I remember this, I can be much more open to their view. I see if I can listen to their view without the filter of my view. It’s a real practice because when I’m listening to their view, my view comes up anyway, but at least it creates some space for the other person’s view within myself.


Perhaps relax what's allowed a little. Otherwise I learn a lot from your discoveries 🙏
btw, if as I assume you started this thread, what's with the 'deleted member' username for the early posts? Another mysterious twist?!
 
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I think he can, to some extent, perhaps being more careful, yes, but as an artist exploring the modern human condition, there's a case for being able to at least acknowledge variety? You have to really. Take that quote you produced of Morrissey saying Trump would race into war for peace, while it's Biden who insists he must keep wars in Ukraine and Gaza going for Americans' best interest, in terms of both the economy and security. The world is in flux. Governments and institutions of the West are supposed to be tolerant and diverse, and supportive of dialectic reasoning. When beliefs that don't chime with one's own are ignored or outlawed, there's little chance for either side to understand issues.

How can you consciously contemplate, when there's no debate, no debate?



Perhaps relax what's allowed a little. Otherwise I learn a lot from your discoveries 🙏
btw, if as I assume you started this thread, what's with the 'deleted member' username for the early posts? Another mysterious twist?!

It's what the far right were projecting on to him - not what he was "exploring". Patriotic Alternative & For Britain were openly fighting over him - they're both BNP offshoots. PA are upfront white supremacist. FB wanted to be elected as a "centre right" anti-immigration party. Both had/have activists meddling in the fanbase.

I deleted my original account because I got upset about something ridiculous (in hindsight).
 
I assume Tommy Robinson was with Patriotic Alternative, which doesn't ring a bell for me. Let it be.

No denying your valiant, intelligent, energetic and largely successful efforts to extract Morrissey from narratives being foisted on him. I think what others say is often valid too though. He did publicly wade in to contentious territory. And right-wing ways are often standard practice now e.g. https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/sunak-offers-italys-post-fascists-spirit-thatcher and https://www.caitlinjohnst.one/p/the-atrocities-in-gaza-are-the-perfect

This constant re-adjustment more towards one side, then towards the other, is probably typical.

The Smiths were'considered leftist', but were not without controversy and strong even radical opinions. The lyrics asked many existential questions about all kinds of things, implying an openness to new information, along with feelings of ignorance, anxiety and confusion often too. Feelings which BBC documentary-maker Adam Curtis concludes have become mainstream around the world - https://www.esquire.com/uk/culture/...-cant-get-you-out-of-my-head-documentary-bbc/

Do you remember the investigation Jason Leopold did about a year ago for Bloomberg, correcting US intelligence service' claims that they never interviewed Morrissey? During Leopold's own podcast interview about this, he said he regarded Morrissey as a sort of lightning rod illuminating cultural flashpoints. My sense is something like that's going on. Also around that time, during a show in New York, I think, Morrissey actually apologised on stage for letting fans down in this respect. Someone else may find it; the night he did the ab lib version of How Soon Is Now, I'm sure. And when people say his views have been problematic over the past 6 years or whatever, you better than anyone can show worrying comments have been few and far between, and for quite some time now, are a thing of the past.

So that's the explanation for the earlier username. Same deal for when you were timed out a few months ago? :squiffy:
 
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