Morrissey Central "CARMEN VANDENBERG AT LEEDS" (July 13, 2023)

Listen - I love and miss Alain too, but this isn't much different from what he used to play in this section too. Both guitarists are proficient players, but hardly virtuosos. Nor do they need to be to serve the song. My main worry in losing Alain was as a co-writer, though Note Dame has shown that even that may not match up to past glories.
 
I don't hate Jesse Tobias. I've defended him and his talent and even his looks on here. But if Morrissey decides it's time for Jesse Tobias to go, then out he goes. In five years the band might be Larissa Liveir, Juan Galeano Toro, and a drum machine named Mike Joyce Jr. and we'll still be bitching about things.


In my 3 decades of going to shows, I've never bitched about the band. Why would anyone bitch about the band. They have all been great to at the very least above adequate players.

I've had my favorites: Mike Farrell solos (whoa whoa whoa)
Boz being a f***ing weirdo in drag lol
Jesse making his constipation face during his Speedway guitar solo lol
Morrissey commanding his tear ducts kick into action during PPPLMGWIW

At the end of the day, Morrissey is the decision maker. If he has wanted Alain to stay, Alain would have stayed. If he wakes up tomorrow and decides that Jesse has to go, then Jesse will go.

He who signs the check is the boss.
 
I couldn't agree more with your comment. He had a very strong visual stamp on his work, which was his cover sleeves, and symbolism...
Poor old SER gets so much stick for all his efforts. I think it could possibly be lots worse. At least with the Carmen special (and Camilla's ectoplasm one) he seems to be developing some effects skills now. He at least has provided a constant record of so many shows.
There was one I found strangely enjoyable where he inadvertently kept recording after the encore. There were tantalising strange-angle glimpses of wandering around chatting with fans and leaving the hall as all the excitement died down. Sadly it didn't stay up long before being hastily cut short. I loved it.
My understanding it's only part time that Alain will be returning?. Did I read that somewhere?. Either ways it's a fresh approach to the songs. Remember in 9, the classic and still best line up brought some serious life into the viva hate / kill uncle slower tunes. I will be at Dublin this weekend so I will hold my judgement until then. YT videos never really do justice. As for all the constant SER attacks?. WTF is that all about. He is Mozzer's nephew and appeared in Suedehead so there is obviously a close relationship.
Alain's FB response does seem to suggest a possible return. If things work out and Carmen stays could he step in again - poss on Jesse's side? It could easy happen if Jesse was to stray on here and see all the unbridled hate channelled his way prompting him to pack away his plectrums. I've never understood people's attitude to him. Is he really such a monster?
 
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Get rid of Jesse, bring back Alain.

A line up with Alain and Carmen sounds good to me.

Jesse isn't going anywhere. Morrissey is his meal ticket.

But, if he was to leave, I'd rather have Alain and Boz over Alain and Carmen. She just doesn't really fit in, playing wise.
 
Jesse isn't going anywhere. Morrissey is his meal ticket.

But, if he was to leave, I'd rather have Alain and Boz over Alain and Carmen. She just doesn't really fit in, playing wise.
Although no explanation was given when Boz left (which was weird, but that’s another discussion), it seems he has retired from touring.
 
I’ve wondered all week if this forum is just simping for the fact there’s a female guitarist in the band. Her tone and application of the fundamental leads of the Morrissey/Smiths songs is underwhelming at best. What good is wankin’ off random scales if you can’t even play HSIN consistently? With what tickets cost these days, we deserve to hear some playing that doesn’t sound like a last minute fill-in. I’ve been getting downvoted all week for those opinions but it seems others are coming around.
 
In my 3 decades of going to shows, I've never bitched about the band. Why would anyone bitch about the band. They have all been great to at the very least above adequate players.

I've had my favorites: Mike Farrell solos (whoa whoa whoa)
Boz being a f***ing weirdo in drag lol
Jesse making his constipation face during his Speedway guitar solo lol
Morrissey commanding his tear ducts kick into action during PPPLMGWIW

At the end of the day, Morrissey is the decision maker. If he has wanted Alain to stay, Alain would have stayed. If he wakes up tomorrow and decides that Jesse has to go, then Jesse will go.

He who signs the check is the boss.
It seems Alain chose to leave over the conduct of Donnie Nutcase.
 
I’ve wondered all week if this forum is just simping for the fact there’s a female guitarist in the band. Her tone and application of the fundamental leads of the Morrissey/Smiths songs is underwhelming at best. What good is wankin’ off random scales if you can’t even play HSIN consistently? With what tickets cost these days, we deserve to hear some playing that doesn’t sound like a last minute fill-in. I’ve been getting downvoted all week for those opinions but it seems others are coming around.
Wonderful comment.
 

S
With the new folks in the band, all the songs are
gettin' a fresh new sound and feel.
I fecking agree x1000%
It was such a brilliant night. I think this tour is gonna be mega. It actually made me well up a few times. There is something fecking special about seeing M in the UK. He's home and he is at his best. I have seen him in a few countries since the 80s Smiths days and I have seen him in the USA fecking loads, including Moz Angeles. He does some good shows but he's rarely as good as when in the UK. Not being a fecking dick about it. Just sayings
In Leeds I met some young fans who reminded me, just how special M was to me and still is I remembered what was special about him, its the way he makes us feel and I cried like a blasted fecking baby. He isn't going to be around forever, we should try and project the positive feeling we have for him, rather than bitching about the fact he said something.
If someone leaves the band, rather than say "That's it, it's all fecking over now mate" and nasty fecking bollocks . We should wait and see what happens and show support. That's what the gig in Leeds reminded me. The fans I met don't come on here, they don't bother with M Central, and they don't give a fecking shiz about gossip. Lots are bright enough not to read his autobiography and have no interest in meeting any of M's friends or M himself. They know doing that ends up spoiling the world M created for them. They like the music and M universe and some follow M lore but that's fecking it. I was totally fecking totally fecking jealous.
On this site people slated M for letting AW and Gus go, but we don't know what was going on. Sure Jesse is meant to be a bad influence, but maybe Jesse is looking out for M. Maybe M didn't want AW in the band anymore . Who knows what was fecking going on? Jesse bad-mouthed Kristeen Young, sure, but he had a point didn't he? She spilt the tea to so many fans time and again. She let it known she was in the stealing fans business .
There may have been a good reason Jesse made it hard for AW. Maybe M wanted him to. Maybe M decided he wanted something new or maybe they weren't that happy about the way AW was doing a Kristeen Young trying to snag some of M's fans. AW's main angle is " AW Morrissey's ex guitarist " Look at his social media there are a few pictures, where you can feel AW is trying to channel M. Then he gets the old M band together and even enlists Craig Gannon. It's creepy as feck. If you're an artist why not do something new, why not do your own fecking thing? Why try and surround yourself in someone else's lore ? I mean, come the feck on, singing so many songs, you never wrote from a band you were never in and then working with someone from that band is a bit on the nose. Most artists try and move forward and move away from someone else's shadow. I get AW is trying to make bank, I get it, he has a kid and needs money. I get it, I'm not trying to be nasty
But maybe M is tired of that, he has had a hard time from the press and has seen a lot of fans leave and people he thought were friends turn their back. His Mums died
So, maybe he just wants someone to be there, for him .
Whatever. we should try and celebrate M more and give this new band a go. I think they are quite good already, they will be fire by the end of the year = if they are still going by then lol 😂
 
Leeds was great. He was in fine form and by M's standards, chatted the hind legs off a donkey. He sounded great too, but same set list, as always these days.

There were a lot of people there who I could see talking the whole way through which is weird asf. There were also a lot of "casual" fans (by that I mean only knew EDILS, Suedehead, etc) that were complete louts; they were paralytic some of them and were pissing everywhere on the way out.

I imagine some of the folks were there to perhaps see the support acts, but there were also people there who were just there for night out and couldn't have give a shit who was playing.

Fab night - better than expected, but I expect Liverpool will have more "actual" fans who are there to see him.
 
Because his songs are sub-standard and the fans hate him.
“In the Future When All’s Well” is an absolute banger - a masterpiece. Jesse will get a forever pass in my Bundt Cake dance card for getting M to do that falsetto bit at the end. Gorgeous!
 
Because his songs are sub-standard and the fans hate him.
I don’t want to seem argumentative here but you can’t make a statement like this and expect to be taken seriously.

Morrissey has an international fan base of millions so you couldn’t possibly speak ok behalf of them.

I know the fans that I know have no problem with him. And I bet that his Mexican and South American fans love that Jesse is Mexican-American. I bet his East Asian fans love that Brendan is Asian Americans.

You should say that there are several dozen fans that you know who frequent this site who don’t like Jesse because the Alain loyalists have poisoned the well. That’s more accurate.
 
You’ve never heard The Healers I suppose.

Yes, I love the Healers, but I’m talking about the Smiths and the guitar in those songs which made those songs unique. If there’s going to be standard rock noodling over them, it’s a travesty.
 
Nothing very highlighted. They put it because it is a woman, they always have us as inferior to women,... Poor men. If it was a guy they wouldn't publish it, they put it as saying ah he plays the guitar ....... Everyone can look at it and draw their conclusions if they play well or not
 
Leeds was great. He was in fine form and by M's standards, chatted the hind legs off a donkey. He sounded great too, but same set list, as always these days.

There were a lot of people there who I could see talking the whole way through which is weird asf. There were also a lot of "casual" fans (by that I mean only knew EDILS, Suedehead, etc) that were complete louts; they were paralytic some of them and were pissing everywhere on the way out.

I imagine some of the folks were there to perhaps see the support acts, but there were also people there who were just there for night out and couldn't have give a shit who was playing.

Fab night - better than expected, but I expect Liverpool will have more "actual" fans who are there to see him.

There were probably a few people there to see The Lottery Winners as are they are on a roll right now having just had their first number one album. They also sold out their Manchester Apollo date in December in a couple of hours.
 

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