Morrissey’s view on gender identity

[nicky wire's legs]

Thank you for joining the truth brigade, you legend!!

 

[Gaetano]

Thank you for joining the truth brigade, you legend!!

I wonder if @Malarkey could accept this fact

 

[nicky wire's legs]

I wonder if @Malarkey could accept this fact

Oh she'll have some way of twisting it to say that that's not what moz really meant, we can be sure of that!!! Boring and predictable!

 

[Malarkey]

I wonder if @Malarkey could accept this fact

He's just saying roughly what her scandal was - she's not actually banned.

 

[Malarkey]

I expect you don't know that Germaine thinks gender is a social construct, you can be any gender you like, men & women ideally should be indistinguishable from each other & that sex shouldn't be about reproduction because we should have less kids to save the environment.

She just thinks a body is an objective reality & changes are cosmetic.

 

[Maxi_Moz]

I am a sleuth, I dig up the truth
I ferret the facts, even when there are none
A silent child, an elegant youth
This led me to find the truth about Ruth
Ruth is John
Ruth is John
We all do what we can
Just to get along
The life you lead, straightforward and bland
Everything happens according to plan
But some people fight just to take root
In a world ill-equipped for the truth about Ruth
Ruth is John
Ruth is John
We all do what we can
Just to get along
Oh, bully for you, oh, bully for you
Your groin and your face, they slip right into place
So masoned and carved, your arrow is drawn
You know who you are, yet you have no idea
Ruth is John
Ruth is John
And sooner or later
We are all calmed down

What more do you need??

 

[gashonthenail]

I expect you don't know that Germaine thinks gender is a social construct, you can be any gender you like, men & women ideally should be indistinguishable from each other & that sex shouldn't be about reproduction because we should have less kids to save the environment.

She just thinks a body is an objective reality & changes are cosmetic.

Moz is making it quite clear he supports people like Germaine Greer and rejects the ideology of the trans taliban. It is exactly because classical feminism believes that gender is a social construct that makes trans ideology so nonsensical. Think about it, if gender is a social construct, how can anyone be born in the 'wrong' body? That's like saying - I was born in a Christian body, but I feel like a Buddhist inside. If gender is a social construct then the concept of a gender identity falls apart. Live your life, be who you want to be, but you don't need men in white coats to 'fix' you.

 

[Redacted]

Time to Move Beyond "Gender Is Socially Constructed"

Contradictions of sex and gender

www.psychologytoday.com

 

[Malarkey]

Moz is making it quite clear he supports people like Germaine Greer and rejects the ideology of the trans taliban. It is exactly because classical feminism believes that gender is a social construct that makes trans ideology so nonsensical. Think about it, if gender is a social construct, how can anyone be born in the 'wrong' body? That's like saying - I was born in a Christian body, but I feel like a Buddhist inside. If gender is a social construct then the concept of a gender identity falls apart. Live your life, be who you want to be, but you don't need men in white coats to 'fix' you.

I don't think you understand what classical feminists believe in.

Germaine thinks you can have the surgery if you want it, that non-binary & agenderism is a thing, that we should have gender neutral toilets, that work should be less masculine, that women shouldn't be taught to be afraid of the male body...

They're not disputing anyone's right to define or modify themselves - the initial split was about organisation & etiquette.

Now, some extremely online feminists have been dragged into making arguments that are anti-feminist.

 

[Lionel Cliffhanger]

This should put an end to any debate. Morrissey doesn't fall for this modern transgender movement. Their ideas of gender and its fluidity are not those that he holds. This was from his show last night in Brisbane:

Thank you for posting this. I think that is clear then. Given his support and interest in drag and trans people (Candy Darling etc) in the past, he is not transphobic in any way. But he knows that women are female and men are male. Sex is binary and immutable. These are just facts.

 

[Redacted]

I don't think you understand what classical feminists believe in.

Germaine thinks you can have the surgery if you want it, that non-binary & agenderism is a thing, that we should have gender neutral toilets, that work should be less masculine, that women shouldn't be taught to be afraid of the male body...

They're not disputing anyone's right to define or modify themselves - the initial split was about organisation & etiquette.

Now, some extremely online feminists have been dragged into making arguments that are anti-feminist.

She is not a classical feminist, they believe in equality, she does not. She is a radical feminist.

 

[Malarkey]

Thank you for posting this. I think that is clear then. Given his support and interest in drag and trans people (Candy Darling etc) in the past, he is not transphobic in any way. But he knows that women are female and men are male. Sex is binary and immutable. These are just facts.

Not just Candy or drag queens. He's talked about his own gender for decades. In 2014 he said: I couldn’t feel any affinity with the three existing genders.

 

[Lionel Cliffhanger]

Not just Candy or drag queens. He's talked about his own gender for decades. In 2014 he said: I couldn’t feel any affinity with the three existing genders.

Perhaps he has changed his mind? Any recent quotes?

It appears clear to me from the clip he is Gender Crutical. He fairly recently expressed support for JK Rowling.

I think you are fooling yourself.

 

[Uncleskinny]

Thank you for posting this. I think that is clear then. Given his support and interest in drag and trans people (Candy Darling etc) in the past, he is not transphobic in any way. But he knows that women are female and men are male. Sex is binary and immutable. These are just facts.

This is hilarious. When I posted similar points I was hounded as Transphobic, which is clearly a nonsense. All you have to do is search the forums for my views. I stand up for women. Always have, and always will.

But when your hero does it - yep, we'll all accept it without further questioning.

 

[Malarkey]

Perhaps he has changed his mind? Any recent quotes?

It appears clear to me from the clip he is Gender Crutical. He fairly recently expressed support for JK Rowling.

I think you are fooling yourself.

Some of the GC's were really nasty about him - plus they'll go spare if they remember the Interesting Drug video - so I hope he's not going to get too deep into it. In the real world almost none of it matters.

This was 2017:

- Just like veganism being gender fluid if not sexually fluid is now much more accepted.
- “I know. It’s extraordinary. People seem to be very relaxed by it... I spearheaded the movement. I know no other way so nothing has changed or me but the rest of the world leaps on. I am pleased because I want people to be happy. There is an expiration date on our lives and on this planet. You have to be yourself and hopefully get some happiness from it. It seems that everybody in every respect of their lives is coming out of their cupboard saying this is the person I’d like to be. I want to wear these clothes, not the clothes that have been imposed on me and as long as nobody’s harmed I think it’s good.”

 

[TheSmiths_1985]

This is hilarious. When I posted similar points I was hounded as Transphobic, which is clearly a nonsense. All you have to do is search the forums for my views. I stand up for women. Always have, and always will.

But when your hero does it - yep, we'll all accept it without further questioning.

I am agreeing with UncleSkinny. I might take my own advice and stop taking drugs.

One can be supportive of trans people in general, while also being very concerned about the gender agenda that is being forced upon us (young people and teenagers, in particular).
If I was a woman, washing my tuppence in the changing rooms at the pool or whatever they do in there, and some Muscle Mary came flouncing in, tripping over their own knob and bollocks… I’d be out of there like a shot. I would imagine most trans people are aware of and understand the sensitivities of others and don’t force themselves into situations that might cause distress to them.
But there are always weird perverts who take things too far. Extreme flashers/voyeurs who get off on making others feel uncomfortable by being where - really - they shouldn’t be. And this is why there should always be facilities reserved exclusively for actual women only. To keep Dirty Doug/Denise away.

 

[Lionel Cliffhanger]

Some of the GC's were really nasty about him - plus they'll go spare if they remember the Interesting Drug video - so I hope he's not going to get too deep into it. In the real world almost none of it matters.

This was 2017:

- Just like veganism being gender fluid if not sexually fluid is now much more accepted.
- “I know. It’s extraordinary. People seem to be very relaxed by it... I spearheaded the movement. I know no other way so nothing has changed or me but the rest of the world leaps on. I am pleased because I want people to be happy. There is an expiration date on our lives and on this planet. You have to be yourself and hopefully get some happiness from it. It seems that everybody in every respect of their lives is coming out of their cupboard saying this is the person I’d like to be. I want to wear these clothes, not the clothes that have been imposed on me and as long as nobody’s harmed I think it’s good.”

Since then he has defended JK Rowling and Germaine Greer for their beliefs which are gender critical.

The video quite clearly shows that he thinks it’s nonsense that someone is ‘canceled’ for believing that sex is binary?

Malarkey- genuine question - what is your take on the video? With respect I can’t grasp what kind of mental gymnastics you need to go through to think he does not have sympathy for Greers position that sex is binary.

BTW I truly don’t think you understand the arguments of people that disagree with you. Many gender crits would have no problem with the interesting drug video. It’s bizarre you would think that.

 

[Malarkey]

Since then he has defended JK Rowling and Germaine Greer for their beliefs which are gender critical.

The video quite clearly shows that he thinks it’s nonsense that someone is ‘canceled’ for believing that sex is binary?

Malarkey- genuine question - what is your take on the video? With respect I can’t grasp what kind of mental gymnastics you need to go through to think he does not have sympathy for Greers position that sex is binary.

BTW I truly don’t think you understand the arguments of people that disagree with you. Many gender crits would have no problem with the interesting drug video. It’s bizarre you would think that.

Almost no one thinks women should be cancelled just for speaking - so it's not as simple as that.

Name these "many" online gender criticals who would have no problem with a school boy in high heels in a video for an adult man's pop song.

I've been dragged into these arguments since the days of Brooke Magnanti v. Gia Milianovich so I do know where the discourse has been going & who is involved.

 

[Lionel Cliffhanger]

Almost no one thinks women should be cancelled just for speaking - so it's not as simple as that.

Name these "many" online gender criticals who would have no problem with a school boy in high heels in a video for an adult man's pop song.

I've been dragged into these arguments since the days of Brooke Magnanti v. Gia Milianovich so I do know where the discourse has been going & who is involved.

But….loads of people think women should be cancelled for their gender critical views. JKRowling is hounded on Twitter/X when she merely states science! She is sent hundreds of abusive tweets advocating rape and murder. This is designed to silence/cancel both her and women who share her views. Women have been sacked and one won an ET because she was fired for having gender critical views.

Trans rights/ men’s rights activities actively try to cancel gender critics.

So to suggest no one is TRYING to cancel women that speak out is absurd.

Like it or not when Morrissey joked about Greer being cancelled for believing men are male and women are female, he was taking the piss about of your views.

 

[Malarkey]

But….loads of people think women should be cancelled for their gender critical views. JKRowling is hounded on Twitter/X when she merely states science! She is sent hundreds of abusive tweets advocating rape and murder. This is designed to silence/cancel both her and women who share her views. Women have been sacked and one won an ET because she was fired for having gender critical views.

Trans rights/ men’s rights activities actively try to cancel gender critics.

So to suggest no one is TRYING to cancel women that speak out is absurd.

Like it or not when BBC Morrissey joked about Greer being cancelled for believing men are male and women are female, he was taking the piss about of your views.

I didn't suggest "no one" Lionel. It's a small number of IRL activists & a lot of trolls.

The GC's are also starting to cancel people since they got some funding.